Author Topic: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor  (Read 13614 times)

Tranz4mr

  • Yardman
  • *
  • Posts: 25
    • View Profile
C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« on: December 27, 2011, 06:38:53 PM »
I purchased a C&S 2-6-0 Lambert Associates for a small amount of cash and found it to be nice to look at but a grinder.


I replaced the open frame motor with a Maxon with mixed results.
The engine runs much smoother but the grinding remains.

What gears or drive systems work best in this engine to quiet it down?
Kent S.
On the DSP&P route

Batey

  • Fireman
  • ****
  • Posts: 252
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2011, 07:35:42 PM »
Info below may help you.
Taken from this site http://roundbell.com/hon3conversions.html

"Lambert C&S 2-6-0 (Nakamura). This very popular model needs the brass idler gear and worm replaced by a Locodoc Delrin Idler Gears for Westside and a NWSL 1313-6 steel worm. The idler shaft bearings may need to be raised slightly to get perfect gear mesh to the driver (file hole up, adjust mesh then glue bearings). A FM-1224 can motor fits perfectly with brushes forward, pop (super glue attached) the motor shims off the frame and solder the thick one back on the frame then "Amazing GOOP" the motor in with proper worm mesh. A FW-130615 will just fit lengthwise but requires a few file strokes of the inside edge of the cab floor behind the firebox to clear. The shape of the motor allows the boiler to be lowered which improves looks. Gauge all wheels, I found the pilot and tender wheels were narrow in gauge. "

Cheers Adrian

HOn3 Logging Modeler from Down Under

Tranz4mr

  • Yardman
  • *
  • Posts: 25
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2011, 03:51:44 PM »
Adrian
Thanks for the info. A couple questions.
Have any of you done this modification? I would hate to sink more money in and then still have a loud engine.
Are there other alternatives like www.nwsl.com FLEA geared drive units?
Those types might be better since then the motor would be isolated from the engine frame.
Does anyone know who the Loco Doc is?
I think he was at the Rocky Mountain Toy Train Show in Denver a few weeks ago.
If so I can arrange to see him at the March 3/4 show.
Thanks.
Kent S.
On the DSP&P route

Batey

  • Fireman
  • ****
  • Posts: 252
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2011, 06:03:11 PM »
I haven't used anything from him. Only because there is no paypal or credit facility and im buying from Australia.
I know someone on here has used one of his kits maybe more. just can't remember who.

I have a balboa T-12 that i am working on. After reading the ideas on his site i bought the gear directly from NWSL.
It turned up last week but i havent had a chance to try it and i still need to sort out the new motor for the mech to.

There is a NWSL Delrin Idler gear for the loco. I can't find it on NWSL site. You may need to search for it yourself or email them directly. Might be worth a try at the $7 price though.

http://locodoc.com/gearboxes.html

" NWSL #305-6 to replace brass idler gears in Nakamura made HOn3 locos                                                $6.95 "

I don't know much about remotoring but i believe the Delrin gear will drop the noise a little. (i could be wrong).
Cheers Adrian

HOn3 Logging Modeler from Down Under

Batey

  • Fireman
  • ****
  • Posts: 252
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2011, 06:05:57 PM »
Do you buy the maxon motors directly? What sort of price are they?

Was just thinking about the T-12 i have and what motor might work. Was going to attemp to mount it as you have here if i buy a round can motor.
Cheers Adrian

HOn3 Logging Modeler from Down Under

Tranz4mr

  • Yardman
  • *
  • Posts: 25
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2011, 07:16:08 PM »
The Maxon motor is a model 1024 (10mmx 24mm) with 1 mm single shaft which I got from "the motorman" .
I paid $40 plus $5 to shim the shaft to 2 mm plus $5 shipping.
Not cheap but I only paid $50 for the Loco new unused in the box from a train dealer friend.

motorman@micro-loco-motion.com
http://www.micro-loco-motion.com/
Micro LocoMotion
825 Norwood Dr #115
Hurst, Texas 76053
817 285 9591

From the box it's hard to tell who made this engine.
Here is the box photo
Kent S.
On the DSP&P route

Batey

  • Fireman
  • ****
  • Posts: 252
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2011, 07:54:27 PM »
Sorry i was looking at the wrong maker there i think.

You may be able to just send the locodoc a email and see if he can help. Its worth a shot.
I think if you find out who made the loco it will be easy to replce the idler gear.

Thanks for the motor info to by the way.

Good luck with the remotor and keep posting the details that you find.
Cheers Adrian

HOn3 Logging Modeler from Down Under

Tranz4mr

  • Yardman
  • *
  • Posts: 25
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2011, 01:08:41 AM »
Adrian
Actually the locodoc kit describes this gear drive in this engine pretty closely. It probably is the correct fix. The box just doesn't list the Japanese Nakamura shop that made it.
Your right, time to send a few emails.
Thanks.
Kent S.
On the DSP&P route

jackpine savage

  • Brakeman
  • **
  • Posts: 86
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2011, 01:57:07 PM »
You can trust Locodoc's info. If he says it will work, it will work. I've used a few of his idler gear kits. They work quite well. Only issue I've heard is getting a-hold of him waiting a while for what you need. I've never had as issue, but I've only ordered gears, not an actual motor kit. I think those take a bit to receive as he builds them to order. Since you already have a motor, another option would be ordering what you need from NWSL. They have the steel worm you need, all you need to do is count the number of teeth on the idler, since it uses the 1313-6 it would be a 0.3 mod gear, this is also a pretty common type for HOn3 models. Here is a link to NWSL 0.3 mod worms and worm gears http://shop.osorail.com/category.sc?categoryId=63 just measure yours and find one with the same inside and outside diameter.  I've always bought my motors from motorman as well, Eldon has a great selection and will work with you to suit your needs, though I may have used a slightly larger motor, perhaps a 1319 to get a bit more low speed torque.

jackpine savage

  • Brakeman
  • **
  • Posts: 86
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2011, 01:58:46 PM »
This is actually more likely the size you need: http://shop.osorail.com/category.sc?categoryId=93

Batey

  • Fireman
  • ****
  • Posts: 252
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2011, 06:08:57 PM »
Its good to see the site slowly building information on remotoring our locos. Makes a good deal of reference material. Going to be good in the long run.

Just make sure you take heaps of notes to share with us  ;D
Cheers Adrian

HOn3 Logging Modeler from Down Under

SundayNiagara

  • President
  • Conductor
  • *****
  • Posts: 247
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2011, 08:55:49 PM »
You don't have to worry about web space here.  I do my own hosting!
Mark

Tranz4mr

  • Yardman
  • *
  • Posts: 25
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #12 on: December 30, 2011, 12:01:51 AM »
Email sent to the LocoDoc.
Meanwhile I'll check out the other alternatives.
Turns out he was the other HOn3 dealer at the Rocky Mountain Toy Train Show in Dever Colorado.
He runs the Salida Roundouse train store in Salida, Colorado
« Last Edit: December 30, 2011, 12:11:21 AM by Tranz4mr »
Kent S.
On the DSP&P route

Tranz4mr

  • Yardman
  • *
  • Posts: 25
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2012, 07:51:24 PM »
The Maxon motor has a 1 mm shaft and was shimmed to 2 mm to fit into the existing worm (screw gear). The NWSL worm is 1.5 mm and a 1 to 1.5 mm shim is tough to get. Because of this I almost bailed on the fix. That was until Wayne, the LocoDoc, called me and applied some highly advanced sales tactics and sold me the whole fix - Motor, Worm, Delrin Gear, axle and bearings. Oh well! Now I guess I just wait. Anyone want a slightly used Maxon motor?
Kent S.
On the DSP&P route

NGPhil

  • Conductor
  • ***
  • Posts: 142
    • View Profile
Re: C&S 2-6-0 re-motor
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2012, 11:55:19 AM »
I'll buy the maxon off you if you still have it.
Phil Light