Author Topic: Re Motoring Hon3  (Read 5329 times)

Batey

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Re Motoring Hon3
« on: December 14, 2012, 01:25:57 AM »
A few people have probably seen i have many locos in bits in boxes. Im pretty good at pulling things apart and never finishing he job.

I have a Balboa T-12 and a Westside C-19 that i want to put a new gearbox in both. Im actually going to invest in the tools this time as i can see myself buying more brass locos. Things like a Quaterer and a gear puller.

Anyway im after photos where people have used a NWSL 50-1 0.3 Mod Gearbox with a simple dogbone connection to a new motor mounted on a silicone bed. Something along those lines.

I want to user the NWSL 50-1 0.3 Mod gearbox, 1.5mm dogbone connections and Mashiama 1015 motor with 10mm flywheel shatf size again is 1.5mm. The combination seems simple and i thik will ilimiate issues with replacing old gears and things like that.

Would appreciate any re morot projects that you have done
Cheers Adrian

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Batey

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2014, 07:30:07 PM »
On the weekend i started some re motoring work. Dug out my C-19 and replaced the motor with a Mashiama 1020 motor.
Was really a simple swap out the old can motor that was broken, then trim the motor shaft on the new motor. The motor fitted into the old mount with a bit of extra brass packing. The shaft was connected with original plastic tube.

Photos to come later in the week when i finish off the wiring of it and also some touch up painting.
Cheers Adrian

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Sir Madog

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2014, 02:51:16 AM »
Adrian,

I have a Westside D&RGW T-12, which I bought 40 years ago. I painted, lettered and weathered it, but has not seen much service. It has been a bad performer from the very beginning and thus spent most of its life in the box. I just recently re-discovered in my attic and would now like to teach it to behave, i.e. be a good runner and puller.

Any experience you can share with me on re-motoring a T-12 is more than welcome!

Cheers!

Ulrich

"People in Hamburg donīt tan, they rust!"

Batey

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2014, 10:59:21 PM »
Hi Ulrich, welcome to the forum.

I didn't end up with the re motoring of the T-12 yet. I did do the C-19 though but its still not running on a layout as such. just up and down the 1m of track i have.

I think with most of the brass locos the first thing to do would be to add additional pick ups to the tender on both sides.

have a look at this for some re motoring although he makes it look to easy!

http://cwrailman.com/Remotoring%20Clinic/Brass%20Repowering.pdf

If you like i can take some photos of the dismantled t-12 so you can see the insides and how its put together before you jump into the deep end on it? I think we can work together on this and get them back on a layout!
Cheers Adrian

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Sir Madog

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2014, 06:52:34 AM »
Adrian,

sorry for the late answer - I am battling some health issues at the moment, which keep me away from model railroading and my computer.

I gave my T-12 a thorough cleaning job and she does run now.  Actually better than I remember she did when straight out of the box. The paint job did suffer a little, but not as much as I thought it would. A little touch-up here and there and she will be as beautiful as ever.

The performance problems are, however, still there. The blind driver rides too low, so she still hardly pulls her weight. She definitively needs a new gear box and motor mount.

Locodoc is selling a kit to re-power the T-12, which includes a new gear box, a Faulhaber motor with flywheel, a boiler backhead casting and some lead to add weight to the cabin roof. The DC version sells for $ 155 and the DCC version with a TCS decoder hardwired to the motor for $ 235 - both are unfortunately not within my reach!

Here is a link to Locodocīs homepage:

http://www.locodoc.com/SuperGlideDriveHOn3.html

Cheers!

Ulrich

"People in Hamburg donīt tan, they rust!"

Batey

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2014, 09:26:47 PM »
Thanks for the reply Ulrich, Sorry to hear about your health issues. Hope for your speedy recovery.

I have seen the locodoc kit before but couldn't remember the price of it. Seems Reasonable to me. Unfortunately me T-12 is far down the list of projects as I'm working on some Structure kits to release later this year thats taking up most of my time.
I may have to find some time to did some locos out and give them a run on a test track though.
Cheers Adrian

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Sir Madog

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2014, 01:14:06 PM »
Well, I wonīt be touching mine for the time being. I can run it, and thatīs the most important issue for the moment. I will have to re-power it and convert it to DCC (and maybe sound) one day.

Here is a recent picture:



The paint work needs a few touch-ups, but is still tolerable. Unfortunately, I chose a wrong no. when I painted and lettered it 40 years ago. Little did I know at that time...
« Last Edit: August 31, 2014, 01:17:25 PM by Sir Madog »
Cheers!

Ulrich

"People in Hamburg donīt tan, they rust!"

Batey

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2014, 05:20:45 PM »
Looks a lot better then mine :-)

I actually really like it. I'm planing on converting mine into some kind of logging company locomotive since i model logging and mining operations.

Anyway im going to get back to the workbench and finish off some projects.
Cheers Adrian

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Sir Madog

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #8 on: September 02, 2014, 11:18:04 AM »
Made a quick and dirty video of my T-12 running down my 15" long test track - thatīs all the track I have at the moment...

Cheers!

Ulrich

"People in Hamburg donīt tan, they rust!"

Batey

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2014, 07:34:46 PM »
Ulrich, Didnt get a chance to watch the short video on a computer just my phone.

I spent hours working on my T-12 lastnight and think im getting somewhere.
You mentioned above you need a new gearbox. I think you may be able to get away with replacing the the ideler gear with NWSL T-12 ideler. Its the same as the loco docs one. It made a difference to the running and binding as mentioned in loco doc page. The axle is to deep in the frame and changing the ideler gear stops the teater totter action. Thgat might be enough to improve your running.

http://shop.osorail.com/product.sc?productId=2019&categoryId=170

Do you hvae the origional open frame motor in yours?

I also spent some time working on the side rods. Removed them all and in the past ive been told to clean up the back of them to stop some binding. Just used 1200 grit wet and dry sandpaper on my workbench and layed them flat and just tidy up the back (it takes the chrome off but being on the rear doesnt matter).

That might give you some help.

I cut the motor mount away a long time back as i wanted to install a new can motor. Ive got the details down in the diary but forgot to measure the worm drive outside diameter to order from NWSL. Im thinking of using a Mashiama 1220 with a fly wheel and mounting a worm drive directly on the shaft rather then a dogbone drive.

Also i noted that the drive wheels seem to be out of quater a little. I dont have the tool to fix this but plan on getting it next order from NWSL.

Check the wheel gauge also as that was mentioned a lot in that loco doc page.

Ill keep you up to date and get some photos when i get the new motor.
Cheers Adrian

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Sir Madog

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2014, 02:51:21 PM »
Adrian,

thanks for the hints. Apparently I must have done something right, when I disassembled the loco, cleaned it and put it back together - its performance is much better now, although there is still that hitch in its git-along. I will check the side rods and will treat them like you suggested. Maybe this will remedy it.

The loco still has its original open frame Pittman motor. I think I will keep it until I convert the loco to DCC.
Cheers!

Ulrich

"People in Hamburg donīt tan, they rust!"

Batey

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2014, 07:53:07 PM »
Yeah i don't think you would recognise mine now. Its in many more pieces. I've noticed that the frame is twisted also. Rather annoying as is must have been done at some point in its life. Anyway im learning a lot.

Do you have extra pick ups on the tender?
I was asking some questions over on Railroad-line forums about some connectors and was provided this link to improving electrical pick up. I like the idea of replacing the bottom plate with a PCB to gain pick up from both sides of the engine.



http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/15986
Cheers Adrian

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Sir Madog

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2014, 11:05:04 AM »
Did more tinkering with my T-12 today.

I took the side rods and valve gear off and polished the inside , at the same time I deburred the bores in them. I cleaned the wheels once more and the truck bolsters on the tender. The result is amazing! This is not the engine I bought 40 years ago! It rides quietly, has increased pulling power and creeps along at speeds of about 1 scale mph! The old motor draws a lot of amps, though, but, as I said before, itīs going to stay until I convert the loco to DCC.
Cheers!

Ulrich

"People in Hamburg donīt tan, they rust!"

Batey

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2014, 08:28:05 PM »
That is excellent news. I wish i didn't start the re-motoring on mine when it turned up 2 years ago. I probably could have got away with what you have done.

I hadn't thought about de-buring the bores in the side rods. Another thing to add to my check list.

Maybe you should write up a post on here about tuning the T-12 to improve its running to be satisfactory.
Cheers Adrian

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Sir Madog

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Re: Re Motoring Hon3
« Reply #14 on: September 12, 2014, 02:50:38 AM »
Adrian,

the locoīs performance is still no match to the one of those Blackstone locos, but it is much better than ever before. I need to find a new set of brushes for the motor to further improve the performance - quite a task for a 40 year old motor!

I need to check the gauge of the wheels, but I cannot get hold of an HOn3 NMRA gauge in my neck of the woods. Iīll be attending a Fremo HOn3 group convention in a couple of weeks, maybe someone there has a gauge handy.

Those Japanese brass locos of the 1960īs and 1970īs were quite nicely detailed, compared to what I was used to from the standard fare of Marklin and Fleischmann locos of those years, but they were lousy performers.. Apparently, RTR stood for ready to repair  :'(

Unfortunately, the video feature on my otherwise excellent digital camera is not thrilling at all. Iīll try to make a nice video of the loco running slowly and post it here, along with a write-up of what I did to improve the performance.

Oh, btw, as it seems, we are the only ones communicating in this forum  :(
Cheers!

Ulrich

"People in Hamburg donīt tan, they rust!"